Forum Haiti : Des Idées et des Débats sur l'Avenir d'Haiti


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Forum Haiti : Des Idées et des Débats sur l'Avenir d'Haiti
Forum Haiti : Des Idées et des Débats sur l'Avenir d'Haiti
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manigat may have been right!!!

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manigat may have been right!!! Empty manigat may have been right!!!

Message  OBSERVER KEEN Ven 11 Avr 2008 - 14:30

the old professor manigat had made an obviously insulting comment right after his defeat that many of us criticized including myself; but lately, i am beginning to realize that he may have been right.
president preval is an insensitive and incompetent leader that should have never been reelected; and it seems that a people generally get the leader that it deserves. in hindsight, president preval has too many flaws to have been reelected by the people. many people lost their lives to reelect an incompetent drunk, and i must admit that i am an accomplice;for i have stupidly advocated for his reelection; in hindsight, kkkok must have been right though his motivation may have been more self-interested than nationalistic.
first, he is a known alcoholic; second, he is battling cancer; third, his previous administration was a failure in terms of real accomplishments. just as anything can be taken advantage of, our anti-elitist attitudes will be taken advantage of by leaders intent on creating their own elitist groups.
though i still believe that there are no elites in haiti, it is time that we reevaluate everything so we can exclude some bad apples from the masses, and include some good apples from the pseudo-elites.
because if we continue to see things strickly in black and white, we will continue to undermine potentially great haitians from the pseudo-elites. i am not saying that those that have emerged lately are the good apples from the pseudo-elites; but we have some good ones that we certainly have excluded from the political sphere simply because they happen to be of relatively privileged backgrounds.


Dernière édition par OBSERVER KEEN le Ven 11 Avr 2008 - 14:39, édité 1 fois

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Message  OBSERVER KEEN Ven 11 Avr 2008 - 14:34

it is time to reevaluate the situation; it is time that we realize that just because one is from the masses, it does not mean that such a person will automatically advance the cause of the masses; and similarly, if one is from the pseudo-elites, it does not mean that such a person will automatically repress the masses.

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Message  gwotoro Ven 11 Avr 2008 - 14:38

Il y a tellement de choses a reevaluer en Haiti.

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Message  OBSERVER KEEN Ven 11 Avr 2008 - 14:51

gwotoro, you know what really upsets me is the audacity, and the cruel sarcasm of president preval. this is someone who told his own people that the food-prices are equally affecting him to the point of his willing to participate in the eventual protests. this guy has farms in his homestate where he is a gran-don; his dietary needs are officially assumed by the state; and for him to say such a cruel thing demontrates that he is unfit to remain president. what should we expect from a guy who spends his night getting drunk? imagine bush telling americans that he cannot even take care of his own mortgage, and that he is in the same boat, and that his own circumstances are similar to those losing their homes?
there is another thing that upsets me: the video of president preval behind a motocycle without a protective helmet. this guy is supposed to be a symbol of model behavior, yet he gets behind a motocycle without his helmet.
now, how would the department of circulation enforce the helmet law if the president does not obey it? there is another thing; what if he had fallen off that bike, and gotten into a coma? another election in 90 days? another potential political crisis? wow!!!

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Message  Rodlam Sans Malice Ven 11 Avr 2008 - 15:08

I said in 2006 that I have not seen anything in the previous Preval's administration that deserves his reelection to the presidency.I even wrote a letter asking him to witdraw his candidacy because I knew it will be business as usual.The reason I condemn Professor Manigat's comment at the time is his insensitivity or lack of consideration to the peole who voted for Preval.

Personnaly I do not condemn all members of the elite.Again I have to remind people when I speak about elite I make no distinction between Manigat and Baker or Boulos.However, when someone refuses to obey the laws of the country to pay his or her taxes; or to pay the minimum wages established by the government .When someone paid mercenaries to create chaos and civil war in the country or insult the majority of the people because of the color of their skin then nobody in his or her right mind will vote for these people.

I will not hesitate one minute if I had the right to vote in haiti for a progressive member of the elite like Dupuy,Dr Lominy , jean Dominque if he were still alive or his wife,and many others for I do not consider the color of one's skin as an impediment to rational thinking and progressive attitude. As I said many times before the attitude of the generation of those who profess the "noirisme "in the years 40 is a rational answer to the the attitudes of the mulatttoes of their generation.One has only to review the presidencies of Jean pierre Boyer, Fabre Nicholas geffrad ,Dartiguenave, Borno ,Vincent ,Lescot to understand Duvalier and his disciples.
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Message  Joel Sam 12 Avr 2008 - 7:38

OBSERVER KEEN a écrit:it is time to reevaluate the situation; it is time that we realize that just because one is from the masses, it does not mean that such a person will automatically advance the cause of the masses; and similarly, if one is from the pseudo-elites, it does not mean that such a person will automatically repress the masses.

Keen,

Are you implying that Preval is from the "masses".Preval is a scion of one of Haiti's most aristocratic families.His background is similar to Manigat.The difference is that Manigat emphasizes his background and Préval does not.
One suspects that the emphasis that Manigat put on that background is to give a sense of entitlement ,to him and the country at large.
Preval is part of the elite!

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Message  Rodlam Sans Malice Sam 12 Avr 2008 - 8:47

This is the reason why we have this crisis today.It was obvious to everybody with some common sense that the situation of the poor haitians is unbearable,but Preval and Alexis could not do what is necessary to alleviate the sufferings because they want to maintain the status quo:the same stupid way they are always administering the country,with thousands of bureaucrats ,Ministery of social affairs ,Ministry of feminine affairs , Ministry of health and population,diplomats and consuls all over the world and so on and so forth;whereas 95% of haitians are living with less than 2 dollars a day in a country where a decent meal costs more than 6 dollars.

Despite all the warnings he prefers to buy cars for deputies,give diplomats bonus,dance with Micky to show that he is a member of the masses ,but in reality he is as conservative as many members of the so called "elite."This is exactly the reason why I asked him to withdraw his candidacy.I knew Preval does not have the guts to do what is necessary in Haiti to change the status quo.He thought by forming a government of consentual participation of the political parties he would pacify the politicians ,but he ignores the reality of haitian history :This method of governing has failed before,for the same reason .Haitian politicians do not work for the well being of their countrymen;they see the presidency ,or any job in a ministery or in Parliament as a mean to get rich quickly.One has to look at what is happening in the parliament to understand that the majority of politicians are mediocre people with no integrity who pretend to be saviours ,but who are in reality morons.This is the reason why you have an ex president of the Senate in prison in the United States for drugs trafficking.

I do not approve the overthrowing of this government not because I think it is better than the previous one ,but because I do not think the solution to haiti's problems is replacing a government every two years.Indeed if I knew by overthrowing Preval and Alexis the people will install a rovolutionary council to administer the country I would be the first one to applaud those who want them to resign.
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Message  OBSERVER KEEN Sam 12 Avr 2008 - 12:46

Joel a écrit:
OBSERVER KEEN a écrit:it is time to reevaluate the situation; it is time that we realize that just because one is from the masses, it does not mean that such a person will automatically advance the cause of the masses; and similarly, if one is from the pseudo-elites, it does not mean that such a person will automatically repress the masses.

Keen,

Are you implying that Preval is from the "masses".Preval is a scion of one of Haiti's most aristocratic families.His background is similar to Manigat.The difference is that Manigat emphasizes his background and Préval does not.
One suspects that the emphasis that Manigat put on that background is to give a sense of entitlement ,to him and the country at large.
Preval is part of the elite!


did you read the following part in my previous post in which i have described preval as a " gran don" which means provincial elite in our language:

"this is someone who told his own people that the food-prices are equally affecting him to the point of his willing to participate in the eventual protests. this guy has farms in his homestate where he is a gran-don.."

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Message  OBSERVER KEEN Sam 12 Avr 2008 - 13:06

they do not have the guts, nor do they have the creativity to make things happen.
take for example the case of la gonave:
the prime minister went to la gonave and brought in electricity for the first time in some large areas there; but instead of being creative, he went the same old ways with a gas-based generator at a time when petroleum-based fuel is becoming more and more expensive. a smart and creative prime minister would realize the following: lagonave has plenty of wind and solar coverage. so, a smart and creative leader would have taken advantage of the viable environmental realities there to create a self-sustaining electrical system that does not depend much on the volatility of the oil industry. instead of coming with a viable and solid longterm infrastructure, he has come with one that will continue to depend on rations of gas from donor-countries. that shows that these men are not thinking creatively, and therefore are incapable of solving our problems.
take arial coverage for example:
the capital is not that huge, and aerial coverage will help a lot in combating crimes;
the government and the police may not have money to buy helicopters; but if they are creative, they will find less expensive substitutes; for example, they can use air-balloons with walkie-talkies, they can even use dirigibles made by our science students. they are simply not creative enough to think out of the box.
they can come up with a project of urban gardens where state lands in urban areas are given to young men in that areas for experimental crops such as legumes, and beans, and corns. the technics of square-footing gardening is scientifically know to produce maximal crop yield.
these guys are educated morons, so i am not surprised by their inability.

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